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Second Life and paedophiles

Discussion in 'General Open/Public Discussion' started by Strygun, 31 Oct 2007.


  1. Second Life, an online world in which participants live whatever life they choose, has been in the news recently with the exposition of an underground paedophile group. First, here are some links to news articles regarding this issue:

    http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/topstories/2007/10/30/paedos-target-second-life-online-89520-20034629/
    http://news.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=313156
    http://www.techcrunch.com/2007/10/30/virtual-pedophilia-report-bad-news-for-second-life/

    I was listening to BBC's Radio 2 today at work, and they had a discussion about this issue with call-ins from listeners as well. According to the man who uncovered this paedophilia ring in Second Life, some police are taking a "see no, hear no" approach to the issue, citing that perhaps it's better to let it happen online in hopes that this will be enough of a "release" for the perpetrator that he/she won't do so in real life. I find this fascinating.

    With that background, I want to know what you guys think. Have any of you participated in Second Life? If so, have you witnessed or heard about these groups? If not, what is your opinion on this issue?
     
  2. Om

    Om DragonWolf

    I've never heard of or participated in second life.

    from what I've read about sexual deviation, it's a monster that gets bigger every time you feed it. People who are addicted to this kind of thing -they start craving even more twisted stuff.

    I doubt the police really believe letting it happen is the right thing to do, it's probably more like they don't want to deal with it. If this ring is huge, there are undoubtedly some important, influencial people who would get smeared.
     
  3. Manitou

    Manitou Old War Horse DragonWolf

    Sky is right -- you let this thing feed, it will grow out of control. It is a matter of barriers. Breach one, you begin to work on the next one. Breach that one, you go to the next. Eventually the beast is loose and society will suffer it's existence.
     
  4. Well I personally have played in Second Life, albeit for a very short period of time. I never saw anything like that but like I said I wasn't in the game long enough. I know that Second Life gives people the opportunity to buy there own island(s) with Linden Dollars and stuff. They can pretty much build the island up to whatever they want it to be. So it doesn't surprise me that this has happened.

    As for my opinion on the situation I think it is horribly disgusting that people can be like this. As for the guy saying "people participating in this stuff online should be investigated...etc", what is he doing to prevent this stuff in his game? Nothing. His response was no more than blowing smoke up the public's butt. Also any officer that is warned or suspects something is going on like this and does nothing to check it out or stop it, well he is just as guilty as the person who commits these acts.

    And I agree with Sky as well....a monster like this cannot keep being fed because it will very quickly grow out of control.
     
    Last edited: 31 Oct 2007
  5. i think its more of a matter of HOW to deal with it...at what point will someone wave their "rights" and "privacy" flag...

    monitoring things and regulating content on the internet...whelp...we all agree there is a very fine line between our rights and privacy and what is moral and decent...

    laws regarding peodphiles and child pornography these days are becoming more specific and yet still have loopholes and escape clauses....and these monsters who do prey on children...are smart...despite their sickness...many know the law to such an extreme that they have justified their behavior...in the eyes of the law...

    scary times we are living in my friends...
     
  6. Indeed Test...very scary times.
     
  7. Hamma

    Hamma Commanding Officer Officer

    Officer
    I've always wanted to get into computer forensics and nabbing assholes like this ala' perverted justice whether or not you agree with the whole dateline thing there are actual officers out there grabbing asshats like this everyday.

    Sadly though in order to get into the profession you need to serve as a beat cop for like 20 years, by the time I am off that beat I will have forgotten everything I've learned over the years.

    Second life is just an odd game
     
  8. symen

    symen DragonWolf

    In my opinion, there's nothing wrong with sexual deviancy (which covers a whole host of activities) as long as nobody is victimized as a result -- basically, keep it between consenting adults. Of course, this is exactly why child pornography is a problem -- to create it requires victimizing children.

    I suppose that any sexual activity, deviant or not, could become addicting. Anything that provokes a pleasure response in the brain, causing endorphines to be released, can be addicting. I can't say that I know much about the subject, though.

    I, er, played Second Life briefly as part of a project for work. We hosted a conference over the summer, and we had the creator of the game as the keynote speaker, who gave his presentation from within the game, so we had to learn enough about it to be able to facilitate that. Weird game -- actually not so much a game, it's much more a colorful IRC client than the average MMO. I didn't see anything particularly disturbing while I was in there, but I didn't go looking for it, either. Since it allows user-created content, it's not particularly surprising that this happened.

    I think that this sort of thing illustrates how legality and morality are and should be separate entities. Pedophilia, defined as the sexual attraction to children, not the act of having sex with children, is not illegal, nor should it be -- it's just a thought. It's nearly universally considered morally repellent in Western cultures, though. It's only illegal to act on one's urges, which is as it should be. In this specific case, if the perpetrators are dealing only in virtual pedophilia, while it's disgusting, no law has been broken -- the perpetrators can't be arrested just because they're more likely to victimize a child later -- they haven't actually done anything illegal yet. This is likely why the police haven't made any arrests.

    It actually reminds me of Chris Hansen's show (which I, personally, think is repellant, along with Mr. Hansen, not because of what the subjects of the show were supposedly doing, but because they are treated as though they have already been tried and convicted). They don't tell you that no arrests have ever resulted in a conviction as a direct result of that show: First, they don't actually have an underage girl that the subjects are attempting to sleep with, it's a woman of legal age pretending. Second, they do their humiliation-on-national-television bit with the perpetrator before he has actually slept with the girl, even if she were underage. Third, they work with police, who are always waiting outside the door when the perpetrator runs away -- encouraging someone to commit a crime for the express purpose of arresting them for it is called entrapment, and has long been held to be unconstitutional, and rightly so. Trying to convict someone after a failed attempt at entrapment is just pathetic.

    I absolutely think that actual child molesters should be convicted and sentenced harshly. However, it's not actually something that happens very much -- a miniscule number of people have ever been convicted for it. It's great press for news reporters and police departments, though, so lacking a regular supply of child molesters, they try to invent them.
     
  9. Well I will say this. If a guy shows up at a house with the intention of sleeping with a 13 year old, he's guilty in my eyes and should be dealt with accordingly. I promise you this, if some asshat ever even got so much as close to my daughters with that kind of intention, he will be lucky to breathe his next breath. So I am glad that they are catching these guys before they actually do anything.
     
  10. Om

    Om DragonWolf

    symen, it happens a lot. victims are afraid to tell. part of the abuse is making the victim think they deserved it or wanted it to happen or caused it or making the child afraid of what will happen if they do tell. Most of the time the child grows up without saying a word about it, but with unexplained low self esteem and troubled life.

    Then when they're adult, it surfaces, but too late to convict the person who abused them.

    A lot of pedophiles have deluded themselves into thinking they are expressing love to a child. sick.
     
  11. symen

    symen DragonWolf

    You're correct -- I should have been more specific. What I meant is that the classic pedophilia scenario -- the "I have candy, get in the van" approach, is very rare. Sexual abuse of children is more common, most often committed by a parent, sport coach, priest/pastor, or other authority figure in the child's life.
     
  12. That is very true. It's sad that people would do that to I child.
     
  13. symen

    symen DragonWolf

    I don't think anyone should face justice for a crime that they haven't yet committed. If that were written into law, you could be convicted for posting the text that I quoted above, which would not be just, in my opinion, as you haven't harmed anyone by posting here.

    Except they're not catching anyone. They're only humiliating them for ratings, wasting tax money on failed prosecution attempts, and possibly committing libel -- a man attempting to sleep with a teenager isn't a pedophile -- it's not even a crime in all jurisdictions. The whole concept is just an excuse to find people who they can treat cruelly because not many are likely to come to their defense.
     
  14. I agree with symen's first post. The video clip from the third link reminds me SO much of the whole fiasco after the Columbine shooting and how it was caused by video games like Doom. The articles almost make it sound that if you ever get involved with this Wonderland area in SL you will instantly want to go out and molest real children. Hell, people see enough of that on Law & Order: SVU.

    This is ALMOST like saying couples that say, buys a high school cheerleader outfit to act out some fantasy should be arrested because the guy could go out and rape actually high schoolers. Except in this case, it's through a virtual medium in the privacy of their own homes. I just don't see what's wrong when two consenting adult(I'm pretty sure you need a credit card in order to even have access to the 'adult' portions of SL) role playing with each other. It's sick in real life, but these people are playing a more, and less, realistic version of dress-up.
     
  15. Ground Chuk

    Ground Chuk BANNED

    What we are looking at, again, is Security.

    Are you ready to give up your Freedoms in the event Security will happen?

    Once you do that, are you not one who DESERVES Freedom?

    I don't condone this stuff, but if you really want to stop it, then make sure your children don't wear bathing suits on the beach or at the pool. That way the "freaks" won't have anything to look at.

    Give up your Freedoms for Security, and you deserve NEITHER.

    It is up to the PARENTS, and I will say this again, the PARENTS, to keep their kids safe.

    The government is the WORST place to look for Safety for your children.

    I know I've said it before, but look, who do you want protecting your kids, the government, or YOU? When you are out and some idiot wants to take your kids, what would you rather have, a phone to call 911 and wait untill they get there so you can say "It was this one car, I think, and this guy...." Or "I pulled my handgun and the freak left".

    You make the choice. Have the choice to defend or not.

    When one of your children or more are killed, and you are not able to stop them...how will you feel?

    If you are armed and have the chance to protect your children...what could be the outcome?

    NEVER will you get over the fact that "if only" I was prepared, I could have had the chance to save my child.

    If prepared, you can only say "I tried my best". And your child may still be alive.

    Prepare. Evil isn't all horns and pointy tails. It could be the guy/girl down the street, in the parking lot, in the mall, at the school.....
     
  16. Ground Chuk

    Ground Chuk BANNED

    I want to make something clear here, as I think it is very important.

    First, this is about Freedom.....and most importantly..RESPONSIBILITY.

    We MUST be Responsible, otherwise Freedom is useless and very dangerous.

    I have been carrying just about everywhere I am lawfully able. I carry a loaded, and cocked, ready to fire (just move the safety down with the thumb, one in the chamber), a 9 mm firearm. Ten rounds in the, shall I say, "bullet holder", one in the chamber so it just means a squeeze of the trigger and it goes bang.

    I also carry a full "bullet holder" (eleven bullets) on my belt. That is for jams, or in case I run out.

    In winter, when I can wear a jacket, then the .357 Magnum (my Back Up Gun--BUG) is worn in a shoulder holster, with one speed loader loaded. Need to get a second one!

    I have done this for almost FOUR YEARS.

    I have YET to hold up any stores, rob any bank, rape any females.

    Odd isn't it. I carry a gun, yet I don't do crime. Imagine that.

    The GUN CANNOT make me do crime. Sorry, it just can't do that.

    Why? BECAUSE I'M NOT A CRIMINAL!!!!!!

    Again. I'M NOT A CRIMINAL.

    Gun laws affect US, the LAW-Abiding, not the criminal. They could care less.

    Remember that.

    However, when that one criminal comes to me, I will be ready. I may die, but I will die with my boots on. I have only myself to protect, mostly.

    Who do YOU have to protect?
     

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